Committee Upgrade

com boat 001

Drwyndwn Tyne is vice-commodore of Fishers Island Yacht Club. He’s also the builder and clubhouse manager of FIYC’s new home base in Sailors Rest.

FIYC 001

FIYC

Three weeks ago Drew contacted Analyse Dean to discuss a possible new ‘Committee Boat’ to use at FIYC for races and other regatta functions. He wrote:

“We’d like a committee boat for our race lines. I own one of your 570 Bimini’s, and I think with some modification, it would be perfect. What we would require would be:
• an open cockpit, without the fishing chairs, but with more of a bench seat inside the transom.

• the ability to raise and lower flags and sound a horn as per the Racing Rules of Sailing. This could be from a menu system, but timing might be an issue.
• the ability to have a yacht club burgee and a race committee flag hoisted.
• the ability to turn off or eliminate scripts not required for the function of a committee boat, i.e., I’m pretty sure the sex anims would be superfluous (although, one never knows :-).
The concept here is that the racers can TP to the committee boat to rezz their boats, and return to it after the race, if they wish, then the committee boat would return them to the yacht club for the after party. The flag system would make racing that much more realistic, rather than using chat or gridtalkie, or possibly in combination.

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Analyse agreed with Drew, and they both decided Analyse’s Bandit 580 might be a better starting point. They’ve been working on the idea and soliciting sailors’ opinions since.

Here are Ldewell Hawker’s thoughts on the issue:

A committee boat is needed for formal racing, it as in RL is always anchored so that it is the basically delineated starboard layline. It is never the port end! It serves a series of purposes in RL – close observation point in a ‘barge’ protest i.e, leeward rights – prevents a beam reach to the line. It ALSO represents the mark that the line is judged by TO THE PIN END.

breadnut 001

Often a mast or flag pole is on THE BOAT for hosting various flags. In match racing the committee boat becomes part of the pre-start tactics.
NOW most Yacht Clubs even dangle a rubber boat, or dingy which now actually become part of the BOAT/MARK – see new rules 2013-2016 (the real reason is to protect the committee boat from damage)
MOST CLUBS in RL now use an automated system for starts, even touted as being ‘fool proof’ (joke) gives beeps to raise flags etc, and sounds horn at clock start, and other programmed times. 
HOWEVER, in SL if you are out of the SIM you won’t hear any sounds – of course you can see the flags if your draw distance is set for that. I have a pair of binoculars as when I race most of the time there are at least 4 classes competing so that means I am buzzing around for 15-20 min….waiting for a start sequence – my class is usually last to start.
Hay’s START LINES and timer have enhanced SL considerably, because if you start a stop watch to use – and use it to time a run to the line …you can often BE OVER EARLY as it does not LAG with SL! Hay can correct me (sure she will) but the line clock responds by SL clocking. IT also determined is you are over early….
breadnut 003I used Yuu’s flag system with running match races, and still have his lines and gantry for hoisting them. I found that many SL sailors were simply confused by the flags….and it became a dimension of frustration for some.
In RL many clubs are having various starts from the same lines…and each fleet has: (1) course flag (can be same for all fleets or not) (2) A fleet flag which is hoisted at the 5 min warning (3) followed by PREPARATORY flag WITH penalties for over early (I, Z or Black flag)- FINALLY, WITH 1 MIN TO GO… THOSE FLAGS ARE DROPPED, AND AT THE START THE NEXT CLASS FLAG IS RAISED if multi-class races. NOW the flags are needed as you cannot hear, nor do committee boats shout the start sequence…. 
I can assure you…unless you do this all the time…it will be confusing – event then still unclear…….which is why most RL sailors have a ‘cheat sticker’ and a ‘flag sticker’ in their boats – AS WELL AS A radio scanning the RC frequency!
Finally, a Committee boat should not be huge, in RL many lake clubs use pontoon boats, and on the ocean – larger boats BECAUSE they are stuck on it ALL day! It needs some room as many whom do race duty are volunteers for the RC chairperson – or Race Director.
If you do one for SL, it should NOT be a vehicle – keep the boat a free of prims, scripts and avatars hanging out as possible…
NOW what would be cool, would be a Committee boat that turns with wind veer or shifts, as well as responds to the tides and currents…or responds to tides/currents and has a FLAG on it that shifts with the wind….WWC wind…
Smart ocean sailor use the anchored boats, for clues…to tide strength, shifts in wind and a host of other things….(can’t give out all the secrets….)
So bottom line….EVERY RACE LINE should have a committee boat, KEEP Hay’s timer, you can see it a couple of sims away…KEEP the boat small, AND don’t get hung up on the FLAGS – YOU MAY have to spend more time educating than you will racing!
If you must have flags….well… make it automated, and sort of…for ‘atmosphere….’ // Hawk…

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Jeremia Spotter commented:

Well said by Mr Hawker, there is nothing to add.
Btw: afaik the original “Yuu-line-set” came not with one of Twoheads vessels , it came with joepie Korobase’s BIGhorn tugboat, which belongs to the historical section of SL boating and sailing. I have used Mannie Madonna’s “Cabin Cruiser” for a long time, also with an eye on the historical side …

committee boat LGSo – the boat really doesn’t matter at all. My favourite would be one of this kind:

Hawk’s last words are a good resumee: “If you must have flags….well… make it automated, and sort of…for ‘atmosphere…”

At least : I first can see some mesh-boats … if its too late – and i bump into that boats. I’m using the running SL-viewer and did no changes to the LOD-factor – and would never do when i race. So its important for me, that a committee boat which marks one end of the startline can be seen from a long distance by everyone.

pslande

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Jane Fossett’s initial comments:

Here is a picture of Analyse Dean’s draft build of a possible new committee boat, sitting next to the older one by Twohead Janus that came with Yuu Nakamichi’s raceline.

Dean&Tyne possible Committee Boat draft build

Analyse’s boat has LOD=32 and is not yet scripted. The plan is to (hopefully) incorporate ISAF Race Flag signals and interface with the Hay Ah line for those clubs and regattas that want a committee boat option.
This is a first draft to promote discussion so interested sailors and RDs can give input to Analyse as she puts this together. Please send her your comments. 🙂
Here are my own first thoughts:
1. I understand the new boat will have a smaller LOD than the old Yuu setup. That should help prevent ‘denial of entry’ errors on small raceline parcels.
2. I am not sure if the draft boat is too long to serve as a Starboard raceline end mark. I defer to Jere and Hawk on that point.
3. The Flag signals could be hard to see by racing skippers. I wonder if the Flags could also have a ‘shout’ attached to them so the whole race fleet is notified.
4. The detail on the committee boat is nice but I think most RDs will want the canopy ‘down’ so racing skippers can easily see boats approaching from the other side.

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Armano Xaris said:

I’m pro progress and think it’s a good plan that analyse dean builds a modern committee boat.. I’m against shouting flags haha :-).
You don’t look to flags, but to your slsa timer in sl racing. So i think flags is more of a window dresser for public then usefull for racers…

Blake Pacific

Please keep everything as slim as possible to create minimal lag, and consider this boat might be used under heavy sim conditions in bigger races also. Every tiny bit can add to a boat crashing when we stretch sim usage to it’s limits again.
I think the size of the boat is in a technical way not relevant when you can adjust the position of the startline buoy next to the committee boat.
Analyse might want to consider a startline buoy next to boat, that is part of the boat and movable on this size…

Blake Atlantic

I have no opinion if this boat is a beauty concerning the size, and the fact that it might stay online for a longer amount of time next to startlines in blake sea for example. I vote neutral and think others have opinions about that :-).
Ok. These are my first thoughts.. I wish all could luck who are busy with this project.

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T&D Committee Boat

I put a copy of Analyse’s ‘draft discussion boat’ in the small bay at DYC for anyone who’d like to check it out themselves, and I’ve also put a copy near the dock at Strawberry. 🙂 If there is broad consensus on its merits and features, a new committee boat might be a desirable option for many racelines in SL Sailing. 

Please give Analyse Dean your opinions and ideas on this, or you can post your comments below. 🙂

comm boat draft 1

harpoon

5 responses to “Committee Upgrade

  1. I’ve seen Ana working on the boat and I must say I really like it for its appearance. But, as Armo said, we racers watch our timers and other boats and we’re fighting for position. So there is not much time to look at pretty flags. Also I often don’t even have view of the line during milling and rely solely on my timer.

  2. I was on the most advanced committee boats this summer during the Red Bull Youth America’s Cup and 34th AC finals . As this is not Rl some good points and technologies can be used as examples . One would be the digital clocks on the sides and back . I believe the current Hay line should be incorporated simply because of the amount of them and the fact the other line maker has been MIA in Second Life for a long time now. A feature that i believe would be great would be a beacon or beacons on the line when it starts .Marking the line . As far as flags go another option could be the beacons or beacon change colors on the appropriate times ,With the use of the trap NAV that seems to be used by a lot now . This would almost mimic the Wifi network used at the Cup this summer . Thou it did not show the gates it did make out bounds in courses and was used for onboard boat data . As well as real time Referee on board could monitor any penalties. It was also designed control the mark boats remotely which of course never got used in the end . They did thou threw the network assign the movement of race marks to adjust the marks this was done threw GPS Garmin system it would also show every Ac boat mark boat and boat on the course , As well as the racers . I guess my point is before rushing into a new boat perhaps some future needs should be incorporated before launching it . (Regardless ) her name traveled all over the world had a expressios maker on it a Oven a Fridge and was wifi friendly so we could upload photos direct to editors or social networks .It still has a piece of Russell coutts Ac45 inside her stern Quarter a bow piece that almost fuzzed with the hull and breached the fridge inside .It was also a sturdy platformed Catamaran Perhaps a mini map incorporated inside if that could be done would be helpful . Good Luck .

  3. It seems that a sort of private consultation already occurred on the subject, so thank you to make it more public on your blog as it may impact a lot of sailing areas, races and sailors.
    The specifications as set by Drew sounds good to me. I agree with Hawk regarding some points: “keep the boat free of scripts, keep the boat small, and make it responsive to wwc” (e.g. moving with waves).
    I agree with Jeremia regarding his point about mesh boat, and the fact it can be seen from a long distance.
    Regarding the flag system with visual and sound signals (horn): Such a system conforming with Rule26 has been successfully experienced during the Fizz Cup 2009, in both Silver and Gold finals, together with a transparent line (and a hidden timer for the line). Some may worry about that, but I think it is mainly a question of practice, of habits. Horn was synchronized with Startline countdown, and Fizz sailors were rather used with that, no over early occurred. It made the races a bit more realistic, and demonstrated some advantages in prestart, less “gaming” with the color of the line, more “secured starts” resulting in cleaner starts. I think most of the sailors use the countdown shouted by the line in the last 20/10 seconds. I don’t use any timer furthermore (or the one included in the on-board hud for fizz racing).
    SLSA Start Sequence with Flag System: https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/105212800256726760614/albums/5937836827505759121
    Videos of Fizz Cup 2009:



  4. on the boat rotating with wind and current, when we have it swing around on the anchor, it will need space that’s twice the length of the boat + x length of anchor chain, this may not be the best solution since it will need more space then available, and also the boat is often landmarked as a landing point, and therefor needs to be in the same spot. it can however rotate on its center point, where, to make it actually useful as a visual aid, the flags on the boat can be set to wind direction, and the boat to current direction.

    please let me know what you guys thoughts are on this.

  5. If i understand right.. Hawk comments that slsa timer from yuu does not give accurate information under heavy lag.
    And thus you might get a false start.
    There have been occasions where i could not understand a false start using the timer. So hawk might have a point.
    I think that is below 1% of all races that i started. All other races the timer did help a lot to get a solid start. So my bottum line is… Keep using your timer hud.

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